The Project Pad

What's up guys,

So I have been putting a lot of thought into where I wanna take the 1991 200 20v. After a lot of thinking I keep coming to the conclusion that I would want to be able to kill GTR's.

Here's my question's:

1) how much power would I have to be making in order to kill GTR's?

2) what kind of set up would the engine require to make that power?

3) what kind of suspension and brake setup would I need to handle the power?

This video is what inspired this:

Nissan GTR mit gut 600Ps und Audi 200 Quattro: http://youtu.be/_o2ExgqJtwk

Thanks for looking!

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For reference:
http://www.2009gtr.com/2011/06/stock-20 ... -1255.html

Midnight wrote:For reference:
http://www.2009gtr.com/2011/06/stock-20 ... -1255.html

thanks for the link! Time to do some homework.

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GTR's are sub 5 second 0-60 cars, you would need dsg or enough power to catch it in the long run...


Old and grumpy.

I have thought long and hard about this, I've done insane amount of research about what it would take to beat GTR's on the regular with a 200.. After going to Tx2k14 this year I've come to a conclusion. Buy a Lamborghini and twin turbo it. Haha

In all seriousness you probably won't beat many GTR's. Even on a roll that 200 can't really hang with a stock GTR. you will need a deep 10 second car. You will absolutely have to have launch control and anti lag capabilities. Plan on needing to make big power. I'm guessing nicks new super 94 setup would hold its own against a stock GTR....but if you are into racing cars how often are they stock? Now with just bolt ons and a tune the GTR is on another playing field. You will need to be making huge power...like what Chris (loxxrider) is planning on making. Otherwise save up for something smaller like a coupe and contact hank about 07k plans.

FYI, I remember reading in hanks thread he beat a few GTR's with his 2.6 stroker setup that made 64xwhp. just for reference.

Dutchbroracer wrote:I have thought long and hard about this, I've done insane amount of research about what it would take to beat GTR's on the regular with a 200.. After going to Tx2k14 this year I've come to a conclusion. Buy a Lamborghini and twin turbo it. Haha

In all seriousness you probably won't beat many GTR's. Even on a roll that 200 can't really hang with a stock GTR. you will need a deep 10 second car. You will absolutely have to have launch control and anti lag capabilities. Plan on needing to make big power. I'm guessing nicks new super 94 setup would hold its own against a stock GTR....but if you are into racing cars how often are they stock? Now with just bolt ons and a tune the GTR is on another playing field. You will need to be making huge power...like what Chris (loxxrider) is planning on making. Otherwise save up for something smaller like a coupe and contact hank about 07k plans.

FYI, I remember reading in hanks thread he beat a few GTR's with his 2.6 stroker setup that made 64xwhp. just for reference.

Haha the lambo is a bit out of my budget for now. Well I would like to get to around 400-500 awhp. I would like the 200 to hold it own against the higher powered cars. I just wanna take the time and build it up, especially after seeing all the builds in here. Keep me busy and out of trouble.

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scubagli wrote:GTR's are sub 5 second 0-60 cars, you would need dsg or enough power to catch it in the long run...


Old and grumpy.

Dsg?

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I think we're all failing to see the simple solution:

20v

AngryTaco wrote:I think we're all failing to see the simple solution:

20v

Haha lucky me I already have one :mrgreen:

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DSG: Short for some really long German word for Double clutch gearbox.

Yeah... you're gonna need to go all out. Sub 4 seconds 0-60 and high 10s, low 11s quarter. So built everything plus big turbo plus launch control. I'd say 35R minimum. But that's just stock GTRs, lol. Yikes, better not think about it too much.

Three weeks ago I was sitting at a lights few cars back, heard interesting sounds looked up to see one actually use launch control on the street. It was f-ing fast...


Old and grumpy.

Well as others said it will some doing to get to a GTR level period. I really don't find it that unobtainable however, especially with the recent developments of the 07k and other professional 3B engine builders

The whole crux of a 200 vs a GTR race will be getting off the line, as someone mentioned above to get a smaller car which is true but really doesn't help the Type44 questions. On the bright side it is great to remember that with a full cage the Trans Am Audi 200 was able to get down to a fighting weight of around 1,115kg or 2460lbs. Keep in mind this did have fiberglass exoskeleton but was a standard 200 unibody for the most part, additionally you could be a complete psycho and leave the cage out of the equation saving you 100-200 lbs. The standard 200 20v starts out around 3500 lbs but in an afternoon it would be quite easy to take 500 lbs away with a good old fasion interior gut (Save your pieces) seats/ carpets/sunroof/speakers/amps/door cards/airbag/tire there is an absurd amount unnecessary items, and to be honest it is actually quite amazing how light the T44 is with all of it's creature comforts.

Couple that with a build like nicks out of FRP and you'll have yourself something 'close' to the car that has gone over 260MPH and achieved the land speed sedan record (Again keep in mind that was a URS4, not a 200)

But if we are talking about keeping a creature comfort and AC daily driver, yes it will be pretty fucking hard to hang with a GTR.

Also everyone taco was right about the 20v thing - Why do you think the World Champion 200 Trans Am had 20v and the paltry IMSA GTO ran a 20v?

(HAHA)

Guys,

I appriciate the feedback. It really helps me put things into prespective, well maybe a gtr killer is out of the question since I would like to keep all the comforts that the 200 comes with. i would still prefer to keep it to being a daily driven. That still doesnt mean i can build it up to 400-500 whp. Im just commited to this project and would really like to take the time to build something i can be proud of and thats reliable and fun.

Thanks magellen! You always know how to answer my questions.

high revs
big turbo
anti lag
nitrous
light weight as much as possible

and that should get you closer.

Biggest issue will be the tech, the nissans got that many computers etc that a kid could mess up and still do a good launch/quarter. Someone in a 200 will need to be on top of everything to get it launched and not mess up the gears.

I'd probably go for a tdi 6 speed box just for the sheer length of the gears so once its on boost it can last longer in the same gear rather than keep messing around. Plus the tdi boxes are strong.

You'l need a LOT of $$$$ to keep up with a stock GTR, let alone one that's been modded. You don't want to run into my friend in Indy's GTR, he just dynoed around 1400 whp (he ran 8.70 @166mph last year)

http://youtu.be/ogEQIgNsW98

Good lord

I think that from a roll the chances are better... still difficult tho...
GTR= 485 hp at 6400 rpm and 434 lb·ft available 3200–5200 rpm, Curb weight 3,840 lb

In the right gear at the right mph would be key... the t44 is lighter but aero would play a huge part above 120+mph in the GT-R's favor

In 2010 they bumped the power up, so race an early stock one

An Alpha 9 GTR traps low 140's on pump gas, mid 140's on E85. To get a 5cyl car that quick you're better off going with a small chassis and gutting the ever living hell out of it. In the US there are only 2 quattro cars I know of off-hand that can match or beat that (Chris Green and speeding-g60).

Even bone stock they run almost the same time that Janis did. Add an E85 tune to the mix and they're a 130mph car.


Simply put, it'll be expensive to beat bolt-on cars with a street driven 5cyl, and impossible to beat AMS aplha package cars.

See the EATSGTR build in the Projects section.

Thats about what you would need. You would still probably lose on the strip though.

Not exactly apples:apples, but I was in my buddy's stage 3 s4 when a GTR came up behind us on the highway. Was stock save for an exhaust. We did a few friendly pulls and while he got the jump (~ car length) initially -- which I attribute to displacement -- we were even-steven after that thru redline up into mid-6th gear. That's not slow.

Same buddy pulled with an Alpha6 GTR another day, he said up to 280kmh they were basically even aside from the initial jump (bit more, but not much) by the GTR.

His s4 dyno'd at something ridiculously low like 360awhp/400tq on 91 octane with w/m.

I think the moral of the story is, in real life it comes down to driver-mod first, and hardware second.

If you were really keen on a GTR kill, start with gutting the unessential stuff, an hta35r with QSV and w/m, e85 if available, and go from there. Stroker with a built head couldn't hurt.

PRY4SNO wrote:I think the moral of the story is, in real life it comes down to driver-mod first, and hardware second.

We all know how easy it is to race a GTR


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJmGkWRYWrk[/youtube]

PRY4SNO wrote:Not exactly apples:apples, but I was in my buddy's stage 3 s4 when a GTR came up behind us on the highway. Was stock save for an exhaust. We did a few friendly pulls and while he got the jump (~ car length) initially -- which I attribute to displacement -- we were even-steven after that thru redline up into mid-6th gear. That's not slow.

Same buddy pulled with an Alpha6 GTR another day, he said up to 280kmh they were basically even aside from the initial jump (bit more, but not much) by the GTR.

His s4 dyno'd at something ridiculously low like 360awhp/400tq on 91 octane with w/m.

I think the moral of the story is, in real life it comes down to driver-mod first, and hardware second.

If you were really keen on a GTR kill, start with gutting the unessential stuff, an hta35r with QSV and w/m, e85 if available, and go from there. Stroker with a built head couldn't hurt.

I don't buy that, sorry. How much a driver is needed to point an automatic GTR in a straight line?

mushasho wrote:I think that from a roll the chances are better... still difficult tho...
GTR= 485 hp at 6400 rpm and 434 lb·ft available 3200–5200 rpm, Curb weight 3,840 lb

In the right gear at the right mph would be key... the t44 is lighter but aero would play a huge part above 120+mph in the GT-R's favor

In 2010 they bumped the power up, so race an early stock one

Good point - However the T44 was right around .31 drag and a GTR is either .27 or .26 - So we are not that far off- Especially if you get yourself some tape and remove some 20v T44 trim kaka.

Do GTR's have dynamic spoilers? If so that will severely hinder their aero as speed increased, while a 200 will float freely through the air (And maybe into a tree without any downforce)

fun thread!