The Project Pad

Nice project and very good job

ralleyquattro wrote:John,

FYI all AAN heads have the dizzy casting, only difference was that early S4s used to have the bottom portion of the dizzy supplying the hall signal i.e. they did not have the hall sensor casting up front.

I looked through my pics but do not have a pic of the pump itself, however given I had no issues with the belts I bet I have the one on the right.

So which part of the pump interfears with the belts, or is it the pulley itself causing issues.

I know there is a difference between a 3B and 7A pulley as well, to add to the confusion.

HTH in some way

I didn't know that on the AAN head. You are saying that the dizzy hole was never blanked off in the casting, but rather just plugged?


I don't have any belt interference, but needed to be able to install a idler pulley like any 20vt or 7A would have. The pump that was on the AAN wouldn't allow for this. I will just clean up an early one and swap out with the original and all should be good to go as far as timing belt goes.

Aaahh.. so it's not the aux belt pulley (alt, P/S) but timing belt install itself... now I see... yep, that would be a problem. My AAN pump did not have a provision for the pully either.

As far as I've seen all AANs have the plug in the dizzy hole.

Anyone seen differently?

Cheers

quattro87 wrote:Here is a picture of the two pumps with the 7A on the left and the AAN on the right. Notice the casting provision for the idler pulley on the pump on the left.

Alright i got it now, the part that you confused me on was when you said the aan doesn't have provisions for the 7a v-belt set up... but that is only an issue with the harmonic balancer. I used the Stock AAN idler for the timing belt, but used the 7a harmonic balancer. So when i order timing belt parts i order the AAN stuff, aan waterpump, aan belt, aan idler.

yeah i was thinking why would i need to add in a 7a idler pulley when im using all AAN parts as far as the timing belt is concerned.

That's the part that confused me as well, the "v belt" part.. :slap:

Same as Hybrid, all AAN for the T-belt setup and 7A pulley for the accessory belts.

Cheers

i mean i dont think it would hurt, always better to have another tensioner on a straight run like that but if the stock s4 and s6's came with just the bracket mounted tensioner and they are known to be fine i dont think its needed.

Sorry for the confusion guys. I just took all the AAN timing belt and accessory parts and put them in storage for His Urq build where I will want the extra room out front. I guess I got the blinders on when I put the parts up and didn't think it through enough to realize that the AAN timing setup would work regardless of what accessory damper/pulley was used. Its too late now however as the new pump is cleaned up and installed. :-)

i mean i dont think it would hurt, always better to have another tensioner on a straight run like that but if the stock s4 and s6's came with just the bracket mounted tensioner and they are known to be fine i dont think its needed.

It wouldn't be in addition to. With it the old style, I will have to tension with the water pump.

cool, thanks for the clarity, now just make sure you have a 7a water pump...

ah i see.

Hybrid_Hatch wrote:cool, thanks for the clarity, now just make sure you have a 7a water pump...

The AAN and 7A water pumps are different? The AAN pump probably doesn't have the adjustment slot in it to tension with would be my guess if they are different. I just figured I would use a pump with the newer square toothed cog that was slotted to be able to adjust tension.

quattro87 wrote:

Hybrid_Hatch wrote:cool, thanks for the clarity, now just make sure you have a 7a water pump...

The AAN and 7A water pumps are different? The AAN pump probably doesn't have the adjustment slot in it to tension with would be my guess if they are different. I just figured I would use a pump with the newer square toothed cog that was slotted to be able to adjust tension.

Exactly, the AAN pump is "fixed" the 7A pump is not only the pump but also the "tensioner"

I never noticed the difference between the square and round cogs. Will an AAN belt work with a 7a water pump and an AAN crank pulley and 7a cam gear?

Yea, anything 20v has the newer style belt and cogs. They should work together.

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ah. Okay. My tall deck stroker is using the longer AAN belt, the AAN crank pulley and 7a cam gear, water pump and oil pump...

Are you still going to be able to use the AAN tensioner? What does the eurovan use for a belt? Does the tall deck need much more belt or will the tensioner just be backed off a bit?

THe AAN is bigger belt. That combined with the tension of the water pump in the 7a, mock up shows that it will work. I will not use the AAN tensioner at all.

I ended up swapping oil pumps, using a 7A water pump, 7A idler pulley, and 7A damper/pulley and cog. I cleaned up the backing plate, installed the timing belt and got everything timed and ready to go.

Engine with damper, idler pulley, and water pump installed. Getting ready to time valves with bottom end.


Cam gear installed, engine timed and belt tensioned.





Getting close to having a motor ready to install.




I even used my homemade crank lock tool to torque down the damper/pulley bolt.

Piece of pipe with a spacer welded onto it for a snug fit.




Tool with handle welded on.


Tool installed with the ground to hold the lock and LOTS of leverage to get it tight.




I'm about at that point where I need to take some time and clean the garage to a starting point again with all the tools put up where I can again find them.

Where there is a will, there is a way. I knew those 12 hour work days weren't going to hold this project back.

I like the progress

Looks nice John, my 20vt engine is just at this state. I need to install the crank and cam pulleys and tension the timing belt. Did you use any locking compound on the crankshaft bolt?

For me, hydraulic brakes out, vacuum are now installed, fuel lines are bent to 20V location. Next step is clutch and then to mate engine and transmission.

Yes, I always put the crankshaft bolt back in with Red Loctite. They are sometimes not the easiest to get out, but then thats the point I guess.
I need to get going on the engine bay and get it cleaned up. Did you just rebend your existing fuel lines or cut and extend? Are you going with vacuum assist instead of the hydraulics for simplicity or room? I figured that the 20vt would fit and I could still keep the hydraulics. Is this not true?

Oh and I went looking for your RR project, but couldn't find anything. I was looking for motivation. :wink:

I rebent the fuel lines, no cutting. I have been reviewing a bunch of the 20vt swap threads and followed their lead. After polling the CO urq guys, the consensus was to go with the vacuum assist. I had no leaks with the hydraulic system, but removed it for simplicity.

I may have to go that way also, but have been avoiding it as that is one more thing that would get stolen off His Urq. I really want to keep that car a project car and avoid it being a parts car. :(

how hard is it to keep the hydraulic system?

i was planning on it as long as the water manifold wasnt completely in the way.