24vVR6T CQ Project: EATSGTR rear firewall fab.

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24vVR6T CQ Project: EATSGTR rear firewall fab.

Postby my2000apb » Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:28 am

24v vr6T coupe quattro track monster

I gotta that friends and fellow geekers Toph, Jim, and Ryan, for work already done on the car and work to come.


So here is the plan for the coupe. It will be a 90%+ track car with the occasional fun run or test and tune on the street. The car is completely gutted and going through a major body transformation.

Chassis worked started this winter down @ Haydn’s shop, a ton of work has already been done so ill be working on catching us back up to current timeframe.
The decision to work with Haydn was exceptionally easy. The engineering and fabrication the went into his S4K project are just awesome! http://www.motorgeek.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=29308" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
We got together a few times to develop a plan for the car, and a few weeks later he came to pick up the car and we were off to his shop. As soon as the car was on the lift the cutting began. The battery tray was already out, a ritualistic project first step/ceremonial moment, and we got right into the important things. Mounting a 24v vr6 that comes in it’s donor car as a transverse mount. We had a few unusual obstacles as the motor was now being mounted longitudinally for use with Quattro!!! Car is also using custom rear mounting for a large chassis, t44/c4, rear differential, which is great as I can swap in a torsen v8 unit or a c4 locker unit as I see fit.

The chassis, motor, and driveline choices will all be explained when we get to them. I am looking to build not the lightest car, but a lighter car with much better than factory balance and handling, and to make it quite powerful but also reliable and easy to work on when that must be done. I feel quite confident that it will be a strong, reliable, amazing piece of machinery when we are finally done.


Chassis/ Braking
HT driver and passenger seats have been moved back about a foot
HT steering arms/ strut housings
HT heim jointed tie-rods
HT custom trans and exhaust tunnel
HT driver motor mount arm
custom passenger side alu motor mount arm with manual tensioner, belt roller and alt. mount
HT removable trans mount bar and delrin bushing
extended shifter linkage and steering column
HT camber/castor plates front and rear, raised as well
HT front strut bar
custom alu center support
front mount radiator and IC
many more things that ill be adding as I remember them
aluminum subframe mounts
rear mounted battery

Engine/ Driveline
24v VR6 BDF code block
R32 cylinder head w/round exhaust ports
Vw touareg 3.2L oil pan, shortened
custom intake using ross machine velocity stacks
custom ss t4 equal length, twin-scroll exhaust manifold
4” ss downpipe, 3.5” exhaust, aluminum, straight through
dual Tial MVR 44mm watercooled, v-banded wastegates, 2" long tube WG dumps
Holset super 40, 7 blade billet compressor wheel + 19cm^3 t4-divided housing
HT v8/urS rear diff in oem housing all custom mounting
Compression dropping spacer
Vipec V88 engine management
034 r32 intake manifold phenolic spacer
earl’s 25 row -10an oil cooler
Vanjen couplers all around
custom 3x 10AN catch can with dual 1" outlets
16AN turbo oil drain
complete AN cooling system with 20AN main lines
034 vr6 oil flange adapter plate
injectors to be decided
urS6 95.5 wide first 01E
B5 S4 shifter linkage, extended
034 motorsport spec motor and rear diff mounts


Suspension
custom subframes and tubular control arms, fully spherical and adjustable
with geometry compensation
much more info to come

braking/wheels
Compbrake 5:1 race pedal box w/ bias adjustment
Compbrake hydraulic handbrake w/ pressure adjustment
HT Wilwood to b3 knuckle brake adapters for 320mm rotor
custom rear brake adapters for b5 s4 calipers and b6/7 300mm rotors


Companies, Products, and Links

-Haydn Taylor @ http://www.motorsport-HT.com chassis, driveline, and suspension fabrication

-Ryan Higbee @ Higbee Performance Fabrication [url]hpfabrication@gmail.com[/url]


many many more to be added as parts and fab are added/updated



Ok so this project has been in the works for a loooooong time, so here’s a quick story about the slippery slope and its inevitable delays. It started off a few years ago when I was out of college and bought a 97 a4 1.8t, got it chipped and such put some sway bars on it and enjoyed it for a while. Having the full intent to turn it into a full on caged track only car. Then I started shopping around for a turbo upgrade, being not that sure what I wanted to put on the car and whatnot I remained undecided for a while. All the time I’d been pricing out turbo upgrades and internals and such as id need a full built motor to make the power I want. As I mulled that over in my head the b5 s4 tuning had been coming along nicely, GT turbo kits were coming out, the big single snail idea was getting thrown around a lot more. After seeing all the power that the b5 S guys were putting down on stock motor, that seemed like the way to go. As the car prices were falling and a fully built motor isn’t cheap, I decided to trade up for a S4 because I’d be able to make ~450whp on a stock long block without issue. So yes, it was a anew car, but they were both B5’s so the majority of my parts carried over and what didn’t, well those got sold off. So here I am with the S4 and I’ve been working for a company that provides me with a car. So the S was destined to become the track car. I spent most of one summer driving it around in chipped form with a fully gutted car and a single race seat, it was light and fun and pretty damn fast once you take 800 lbs of misc. stuff out of the car. In the quest for a track car, and realizing the maintence hassle of the 2.7tt, and the inability to change things/ replace parts quick and easy, made it seem like this might not be the motor for a track beast that needs to be torn down off and on throughout the year. Enter the 24v VR6. this motor is more compact, much easier to put a single turbo on, its mostly one of part, not like the 2 of each in the s4. with its tight V angle and single cylinder head there was massive amounts of room in the engine bay, its great all the exhaust is on one side and intake all on another. It was simple and easy to work on/around. As the epic pile of parts continued to grow the issue of tuning loomed like a dark cloud. In my state, any car 1996 and newer is subjected to an OBD plug in readiness code check. the combination of wanting to go mega big turbo on the vr6 and the fact that this motor never came in a b5, and this and that, and the fact I wanted some launch control, boost by gear etc the answer suddenly became very clear, standalone engine mgt, but yea it’s a 2000 model year car, so it would need to pass OBD readiness etc and all. While it may be possible, it would cost a fortune and be a hassle etc. so the only way to run a standalone was to get into a pre-1996 chassis. So I did just that. Out with the old and in with the new-er-to me. Gone was the b5 s4 and enter the ’90 coupe Quattro.
I got the CQ shell from member here last summer in exchange for b5 s4 o1e swapping his DD CQ. Prior to me getting it, the shell had been completely stripped and beadblasted, what a relief, I’m glad I don’t have to do all that.




so ill start with a reasonably current pic, and then start catching up from the beginning

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Last edited by my2000apb on Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:58 pm, edited 6 times in total.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby my2000apb » Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:28 am

UPDATE!!

battery tray is out
rear seat sheet metal is out
i got my first of many boxes of parts, s6 adjustable column, with switches and ignition and the vr6/o1e adapter plate, also some 034 motorsport spec motor, trans and dif mounts
and the car is on its way to Haydn's shop for all sorts of chassis goodness

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Last edited by my2000apb on Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby my2000apb » Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:28 am

UPDATE!!

ok so we got the car down to Haydn's and its now ready for the major work to begin. Haydn has had a few days to get stared on some stuff while ive been away at work. the motor finally showed up, 2.8l 24v vr6 BDF code from a mk4 gti. I got the block, crank, pistons, rods, complete head and some other small stuff. it came with proper rings, rod and main bearings. the motor was removed because it spun a rod bearing, its been machined out, and it came with the correct bearings. I brought the motor down to the shop to get it together with the trans and put into the shell.

i took a good while to check out the motor, man are these things beefy or what! this motor is NO lightweight!!, its def heavier than a 7a! im pretty sure we can still get the car to accelerate :) there are 7 huge mains and the motor is only 17" long! also the space between cylinders is quite thick. i wont be crackign any blocks like those turbo R32 guys, thats for damn sure

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Last edited by my2000apb on Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby my2000apb » Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:28 am

ok, updates continue, we are slowly getting closer to being caught up.

since the last time, i went by force 5 to get my super clean CQ dash and the b4 hood/grille

the pics show H's seat for mockup, i still havent decided for sure what seat i want, input is welcome

the car continues to be stripped down to the bare essentials,
-the rear seat stuff is completely gone
- old front seat mounting is all gone, replacements welded in, man is all that stock stuff heavy!
-removed the "hump" support in middle of front floor area, reinforced floor from below
-underbody seat/floor reinforcments, installed
-recaro/fia cert. seat slider installed
-cage knee bar is tacked in and frog mouthed for the A pillar bar
-we got the steering column, kneebar, seat mounts and rails installed
-we managed to layout about how the cockpit will look when all is put together
-and lastly haydn in drivers seat, working on layout

if you think the steering column is far back now, its in its temp location as it will be 2.5-3" further back once I put in a quick release steering wheel hub.

im not exactly sure how far rearwards and inboard my seat is now compared to a stock cq, but ill check my friends stock coupe and report back

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Last edited by my2000apb on Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby my2000apb » Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:29 am

Ok update time, ive been away from my car while its been @ Haydn’s shop getting major work done. I was back home for a bit and got a chance to swing down and check out the progress. Toph and myself spent several more hours cleaning up unused mounts, bosses etc. he went at the inside of the cabin and I took on the engine bay. Its amazing how much factory stuff can be ditched when switching to a standalone mgt system.

its time to finally mount the motor in the chassis. Haydn went through several different drivers side mount arms before we decided which one to use. We wanted a mount that would hold the motor in but also allow some adjustability and ease of motor install and removal. A lot of the motor and trans mounting design was with the consideration of removing and reinstalling the motor. It’s a timing chain motor and its on the back of the block near the bellhousing, so in no way do I want to be messing with timing/cam chains with the motor in the car. The drivers side arm utilizes some of the bellhousing bolts and some of the accessory bracket bolts. The passenger side is much easier to mount as there are a lot more bosses available and theres a lot less mounted on that side of the motor anyway. Both of the mounts are slotted to allow fine adjustments of the driveline.

the mount arms will get powdercoated eventually, they are finished but i will be adding an exhaust manifold support and possibly one for intake manifold as well, once they are final final i will coat them

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Last edited by my2000apb on Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby my2000apb » Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:29 am

Ok time for more updating, the motor mounts are made and in so its time to stop supporting the trans and mount it into place. Initially we were going to make replica rs2 oem style mounts, but after much test fitting and moving the motor back, the rs2 mounts just wouldn’t work. The motor is pushed sooooo far down and back the rs2 style mounts would have to be extended quite a bit and just not be that practical. So Haydn set to designing a trans cross bar that would serve several purposes. First and most obvious, it would support the transmission. It is also removable. This will make the removal and install of the motor/trans combo sooo easy. The trans basically sits on top of the bar and the mounting bolts go up from under, through trans bar, through a delrin slab/bushing and into the center diff housing, this trans isn’t going anywhere.

the trans bar sits on plates that are welded to the framerail, it is very string and will make a great add'l jacking point if needed

pic time

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Last edited by my2000apb on Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby my2000apb » Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:29 am

Haydn also build a removable tunnel top, so I can have easy access to the linkage and slave cylinder area. It will make working on the car much easier as everything is soo much more accessible.


Because the motor/trans has been moved back so far, haydn needed to make a tunnel from scratch. The shifter plate mount was wrong, it was too cramped, no room for exhaust at all, no room for b5 s4 linkage, etc etc. so he set to making a tunnel from the floor up. While moving the motor back and down has its great advantages, it does bring up many smaller fitment issues that we are addressing with this tunnel.

Tunnel
- allows trans to be so far back
- moves shifter box back and closer to steering wheel
- has reliefs for b5 s4 shifter linkage
- exhaust / downpipe tunnel reliefs
- allows more room around linkage and trans for easier access

The b5 s4 shifter linkage will need to be extended by almost 12 inches because im sitting so far back.

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Last edited by my2000apb on Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby my2000apb » Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:29 am

Ok time to get the rear dif in place. I am running an oem untouched v8 rear torsen dif., stock housing and all. The diff can come right off the v8 and be bolted into place. This is soo much easier than gut swapping into a small chassis diff. it also allows me to drop in a locker urS unit instead for drag racing. Best of both worlds with a quick diff swap.

The rear v8 mount has been modified and extended by 65mm for use with the v8 auto driveshaft and small chassis rear subframe / frame mounting. Trans mount brackets have been cut off rear subframe and the front mount is a bar with gusseted mounts under the body. I will be making ¾” and 1” delrin round stock mount bushings for those mount tabs. The rear diff mount retains its stock “slotting” In the back for fine adjustments.

Shown 034 motorsport spec rear diff mount

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Last edited by my2000apb on Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby my2000apb » Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:29 am

UPDATE! the driveline is in. time to move on to controlling this monster.

one of the largest advantages to having a two door vs a four door, is that i can move my seating position quite a bit rearwards and still have room infront of the B pillar for the halo bar. Ill have to ask haydn or go measure, exactly howfar back the seat has been moved. so in doing that we needed to move the seating and steering column rearward as well as the pedal set.

the pictures shown are all accurate except the steering wheel will be about 2.5"-3" back once i install a quick release hub.

im running a Compbrake 5:1 race pedal box and their hydraulic handbrake, which is nice as they come with a F/R bias adjuster and a pressure adjuster for the handbrake, etc

im using an urS6 steering column. this allows the wheel to be tilted and telescoping. i will be relocating the stock igniton switch

the steering column mount that haydn made allows the steering column to have a large range of adjustment, to dial in exactly how it feels in the cockpit of the car.
the pedal box is mounted on the floor, but on a square stock bracket so it too can be moved forward or rearward.

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Last edited by my2000apb on Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby my2000apb » Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:29 am

Ok heres a few more pics of the Compbrake pedal box

Haydn made me a pretty sweet dead pedal to go with the set, as shown

The only thing the compbrake box doesn’t have is throttle linkage sorted out yet, so that will be on the table at a later date.

You can see the upclose bracket it sits on, it is currently nutserted inplace, and can be moved anywhere on the bracket

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Last edited by my2000apb on Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby my2000apb » Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:29 am

SUSPENSION TIME!!!

Starting off at the top and working our way down, first stop, strut tops and making them adjustable. These cars obviously tend to understeer from the factory, they respond well to more castor upfront. Haydn built these strut tops from scratch and has installed them onto my car. They are setup to be more adjustable for castor, as the balljoint has a lot of camber adjustment in it already by design. First we will go over prepping the car for the strut tops, then construction and installation of the tops and finally a strut top bar and alignment angles.

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Last edited by my2000apb on Fri Mar 22, 2013 10:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby my2000apb » Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:31 am

ok strut top mounts update 1.1

car is prepped and ready for the tops, now to prepare the tops for installation welding

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Last edited by my2000apb on Fri Mar 22, 2013 10:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby my2000apb » Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:37 am

ok time to get these strut mounts onto the chassis! its really coming together now!

so strut tops are mounted and ready

completely seam sealed and ready for some badass uprights and suspension

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Last edited by my2000apb on Fri Mar 22, 2013 10:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby my2000apb » Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:37 am

ok so the strut tops are in, and awaiting camber/castor plates

we decided to put a strut tower bar in "while we were in there" haha

also included below are the strut tops alignments post welding / install

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Last edited by my2000apb on Fri Mar 22, 2013 10:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby my2000apb » Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:37 am

ok wow what a bunch of pics, and an epic pile of labor hours from haydn.

truly awesome work
so most of the major chassis fab is done and the car is now coming back to me and its new temporary home.

so the shell was truly a roller, and thats it, it would roll and barely. when i got it, all four wheels had independent steering, balljoints held in with safety wire ahaha, it was not an easy shell to move as one person. so haydn made up a few custom tierods for me ahahah

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Last edited by my2000apb on Fri Mar 22, 2013 10:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby HT Motorsport » Sat Apr 16, 2011 2:24 pm

Tim, so sorry to hear you had an eye issue today, eye injuries have to be about the most painful there are. hopefully you will recover soon so we can catch up on this stuff.

Glad to see the cat is coming out of the bag on this thing, I have been gagging to tell people about it but was sworn to secrecy. As Tim mentioned, this car is going to be a killer fast but reliable track day toy. I am glad to have the opportunity to work on it, and my first longitudinal VR6T project.

Plenty more to come from Tim on this over the next week I am sure, we did some neat stuff on the base chassis engineering.

Cheers for the opportunity to work on a cool project during the infancy of my new business :)

H
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby ChrisAudi80 » Sat Apr 16, 2011 5:49 pm

Subscribed!! Good luck with your eye lid.
96 S6 auto
95 80Q AEB VEMS
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby audidub » Sat Apr 16, 2011 5:57 pm

met up with Tim on friday to look at the car, and talk about his plans for it. its already looking great with the work from Hayden's and it looks like he's set himself up so he can move right along with this should be fun to watch this car grow into a monster. i'm guessing the eye didn't get better after i saw you, hope it heals up quick. :cheers: :cheers:
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby ChrisAudi80 » Sat Apr 16, 2011 6:04 pm

What happened? Fight?
96 S6 auto
95 80Q AEB VEMS
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby audidub » Sat Apr 16, 2011 6:17 pm

he said something about dust clogging his tear duct and it would go away, that was on friday and it looked like he had gotten socked in the left eye.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby HT Motorsport » Sun Apr 17, 2011 1:40 pm

audidub wrote:he said something about dust clogging his tear duct and it would go away, that was on friday and it looked like he had gotten socked in the left eye.



Oooh nasty, I did a project designing a 'dry eye' treatment product about 5 years ago and learned all about punctla plugs and cleaning of the tear duct, very nasty and painful stuff, sorry Tim.

H
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby blacksmith » Sun Apr 17, 2011 3:44 pm

glad to see this start moving along.

hope you have a quick recovery.
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby pilihp2 » Sun Apr 17, 2011 4:28 pm

Eesh. I remember getting my cornea cut a couple years ago and waking up like I had an eye infection, all crusted over and everything. no fun at all.
but the car looks like it'll be sick!
-Phil
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05 S4 - "Daily"
16 KTM 690 Duke - just because

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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby my2000apb » Mon Apr 18, 2011 6:41 am

thanks for the support guys, the eye thing sucked, im a little swollen in my left eye still but ill be jsut fine, it was jsut a pain for a few days. i didnt actually get a shard of metal in my eye at all, it was all the grinding / cleaning dust that clogged up my tear duct and let me whole eyelid swell right up.
figures i wore safety goggles the whole time too

ok back at it, i got the car back from haydn on the 3rd of april, and toph and I have managed to work on it atleast some, everyday since it came back from chassis work. we had a long weekend of subframe modification and i will be updating the thread tonight
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Re: 24v vr6T coupe quattro Project: EATSGTR, grand opening!!

Postby snwbrder101 » Mon Apr 18, 2011 9:13 am

Tim I gotta get over there and check this monster out let me know if you need a hand.
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